Nobody Should Believe Me

What if you woke up one day and discovered that your whole life had been a lie? When Jordyn Hope learned about Munchausen by proxy in a college psychology class, their life was immediately turned upside down. Everything about their history was suddenly cast in a new light: from the mysterious illnesses they’d been plagued with since birth to the constant emergency room visits to the gaslighting from their mother. Now, years later, Jo returns to their small, rural hometown of Hutchinson, MN to try to put the pieces back together and help make sense of their traumatic childhood. Along the way, the story of Jordyn’s life will be rewritten and their relationship with their mother takes a turn they never could have anticipated. This is a story of self-discovery unlike any other: one of resilience, healing, and surviving the unthinkable. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome to Season 4 of Nobody Should Believe Me! This season we are following the story of Jordyn Hope as they unravel the secrets of their childhood. After revelations that they were abused as a child, Jo bravely returns to their small, deeply religious hometown to attempt to unravel their many lingering questions about their upbringing. Was their abuse a secret? If not, why didn’t anyone help them? Jo connects with her first grade teacher and childhood best friend as they begin their search for answers. Andrea travels with Jo, hoping to help her friend find healing, and to see what the future might look like for the survivors in her own life.  *** Links/Resources:  Preorder Andrea's new book The Mother Next Door: Medicine, Deception, and Munchausen by Proxy Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! Subscribe on YouTube where we have full episodes and lots of bonus content. Follow Andrea on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop Buy Andrea's books here. To support the show, go to Patreon.com/NobodyShouldBelieveMe or subscribe on Apple Podcasts where you can get all episodes early and ad-free and access exclusive bonus content. For more information and resources on Munchausen by Proxy, please visit MunchausenSupport.com The American Professional Society on the Abuse of Children’s MBP Practice Guidelines can be downloaded here. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

While visiting their hometown, Jo reconnects with their older sister, Crystal, to have the deeply honest and heart-wrenching conversation their mother never wanted them to have: one where they share the hard truths about the abuse they both suffered at her hand. Crystal and Jo reach a new level of understanding of their shared experiences and their love for each other. We also speak to Munchausen by proxy expert Bea Yorker to talk about the process of discovery and recovery for survivors.  *** Links/Resources:  Preorder Andrea's new book The Mother Next Door: Medicine, Deception, and Munchausen by Proxy Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! Subscribe on YouTube where we have full episodes and lots of bonus content. Follow Andrea on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop Buy Andrea's books here. To support the show, go to Patreon.com/NobodyShouldBelieveMe or subscribe on Apple Podcasts where you can get all episodes early and ad-free and access exclusive bonus content. For more information and resources on Munchausen by Proxy, please visit MunchausenSupport.com The American Professional Society on the Abuse of Children’s MBP Practice Guidelines can be downloaded here. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Warning: This content includes references to suicide and child abuse. If you or someone you know is having thoughts of suicide, help is available. Call or text 988 to speak with a trained crisis counselor 24/7. You can also visit 988lifeline.org for additional resources and support. As the Jack Kowalski v. Johns Hopkins All Childrens trial gets underway today in Sarasota, FL, we revisit our conversation with top experts Bea Yorker, Dr. Mary Sanders, Detective Mike Weber, and survivor Jordyn Hope about “Take Care of Maya” the Netflix documentary about the Maya Kowalski case. Today we introduce our third season of Nobody Should Believe Me, where we will delve into the complex notion of “false accusations” of medical child abuse, getting into everything we’ve uncovered about the Maya Kowalski case and the broader conversations happening around the nation. Is there really an epidemic of over-diagnosis of medical child abuse, or are offenders slipping through the cracks?  Andrea is a finalist for the Signal Awards! Best Host - Documentary Category: PLEASE VOTE HERE: https://vote.signalaward.com/PublicVoting#/2023/shows/craft/best-host-documentary For more information and resources on Munchausen by Proxy, please visit MunchausenSupport.com  Follow host Andrea Dunlop on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop  Buy Andrea’s books here.  To support the show, subscribe on Apple Podcasts or go to Patreon.com/NobodyShouldBelieveMe where you can listen to exclusive bonus content and access all episodes early and ad-free.   * * * Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

As the Maya Kowalski case heads to trial, we dig into the massive trove of documents about this case and begin to unpack what we know about what really happened during Maya Kowalski’s fateful stay at Johns Hopkins All Childrens in October 2016.   The Netflix documentary about the case—and the prevailing media narrative---would have you believe that Maya was ripped from her parents by a corrupt system, and that this could happen to any parent of a sick child. But did Maya really have a deadly disease for which she required the massive amounts of ketamine and other drugs she was being given? Was the hospital unfairly biased against Beata Kowalski because she was difficult, or was something more sinister at play?   We talk to national law enforcement expert on medical child abuse, Detective Mike Weber, as well as a Florida pediatrician who helps us unravel some of the myriad strange details about Maya’s medical history.   The beginning of our multi-part deep dive into the case reveals the shocking events that led up to the family separation.  *** Follow host Andrea Dunlop on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop  Buy Andrea’s books here.  To support the show, subscribe on Apple Podcasts or go to Patreon.com/NobodyShouldBelieveMe where you can listen to exclusive bonus content and access all episodes early and ad-free.   For more information and resources on Munchausen by Proxy, please visit MunchausenSupport.com  Download the APSAC's practice guidelines here.  ***  Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In our third episode, we look at a central piece of the story that was left unfinished at the time of Beata Kowalski’s death: the police investigation into her for medical child abuse.  Along with Detective Mike Weber and our anonymous Florida pediatrician friend, we unpack shocking new details from the police investigation and from Jack Kowalski’s interview the Detective Stephanie Graham. Was Jack really just being pressured to throw his wife under the bus? Or did he have suspicions of his own about her? We also unpack some of the many discrepancies in Maya's medical history and the troubling behaviors of her mother Beata, showing that that this pattern of deceptive behavior went way beyond the question of whether her daughter’s diagnosis of CRPS was correct or not As the Kowalski v Johns Hopkins All Children’s trial unfolds in real time, we examine the facts of the case as they stood when Beata died and show how the prevailing media narrative about this case is getting it all wrong.  *** To support the show, subscribe on Apple Podcasts or go to Patreon.com/NobodyShouldBelieveMe where you can listen to exclusive bonus content and access all episodes early and ad-free, including weekly recaps of the Kowalski trial.  Follow host Andrea Dunlop on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop Buy Andrea’s books here. For more information and resources on Munchausen by Proxy, please visit MunchausenSupport.com Download the APSAC's practice guidelines here. *** Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Note: This episode contains sensitive content related to child abuse and suicide. Listener discretion is advised.    Beata Kowalski’s tragic death by suicide in January of 2016 is at the center of the $220 million lawsuit Jack Kowalski has filed against Johns Hopkins All Childrens hospital. But did Beata really take her own life to free her daughter from the hospital keeping her captive as the plaintiff claims? As with everything in this story, the truth is much more complicated. The narrative told in the Netflix film “Take Care of Maya” is far from a complete picture of the harrowing series of events that led to Beata’s death.    In this episode we go through the police reports of the incident and various testimonies of those who were present to fill in the gaps of the days and hours leading up to Beata’s death. We also examine the final court hearing Beata attended, which gives us a glimpse into where the case stood at the time of her death.    *** To support the show, subscribe on Apple Podcasts or go to Patreon.com/NobodyShouldBelieveMe where you can listen to exclusive bonus content and access all episodes early and ad-free, including weekly recaps of the Kowalski trial.   Follow host Andrea Dunlop on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop  Buy Andrea’s books here.  For more information and resources on Munchausen by Proxy, please visit MunchausenSupport.com  Download the APSAC's practice guidelines here.  ***  Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In the flattened version of the Maya Kowalski story that has dominated the headlines, Beata Kowalski is a mother who fell prey to age-old biases against women. This story attaches itself to the well-documented reality that women are all too often not believed when it comes to their own pain, the stories of their own lives, and their professional opinions. Beata is cast as the martyr in Netflix’s “Take Care of Maya” and two other women, Cathy Beady and Dr. Sally Smith, are cast as the villains. Today, we unpack the messy gender dynamics of this case.   Cathy Beady is the social worker with a troubling past who’s been accused of grooming and assaulting Maya Kowalski. What do we know about what happened during Maya’s stay at Johns Hopkins All Childrens? Was Cathy Beady really hellbent on keeping Maya and Beata apart?  Media coverage of the Maya Kowalski story has also done irreparable harm to the life and career of the respected doctor at the center of the controversy: child abuse pediatrician Sally Smith. She’s been accused of violating HIPPA in a single-minded crusade to create a case against Beata Kowalski. But is there evidence that Dr. Smith did anything other than her job? Did she drive Beata to death as the film suggests or is it possible her interventions saved Maya Kowalski’s life?  As we break down the narratives and misinformation surrounding this case we get to the heart of the matter. The Kowalski legal team’s claims that Munchausen by proxy is based on “junk science” and that Beata Kowalski wasn’t guilty of medical child abuse because this form of abuse isn’t even real.   *** To support the show, subscribe on Apple Podcasts or go to Patreon.com/NobodyShouldBelieveMe where you can listen to exclusive bonus content and access all episodes early and ad-free, including weekly recaps of the Kowalski trial. Follow host Andrea Dunlop on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop  Buy Andrea’s books here.  For more information and resources on Munchausen by Proxy, please visit MunchausenSupport.com   Download the APSAC's practice guidelines here.  ***  Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show!   Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Host Andrea Dunlop and lead producer Tina Nole dive into listener feedback from season 2 of Nobody Should Believe Me. Addressing questions of gender issues and potential sexism around medical child abuse accusations, Andrea’s guest appearance on Real Crime Profile, pro-cop allegations and more. Plus, Andrea and Tina fill listeners in on what to expect for season 3 and beyond.   *** To support the show, subscribe on Apple Podcasts or go to Patreon.com/NobodyShouldBelieveMe where you can listen to exclusive bonus content and access all episodes early and ad-free, including weekly recaps of the Kowalski trial.   Follow host Andrea Dunlop on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop  Buy Andrea’s books here.  For more information and resources on Munchausen by Proxy, please visit MunchausenSupport.com  Note: This episode contains sensitive content related to child abuse. Listener discretion is advised.   Download the APSAC's practice guidelines here.  ***  Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In today’s episode, Andrea seeks an outside perspective on the controversial Maya Kowalski case. Laura Richards, host of Crime Analyst and cohost of the Real Crime Profile podcast, joins Andrea to talk through the complexities and contradictions of the Netflix documentary. The conversation reveals just how polarized interpretations of this case have become. With the verdict in the Kowalski v Johns Hopkins All Childrens looming, today we look at what’s been revealed by the both the vast amount of documentation on this case, as well as the trial unfolding before our eyes.   *** Megan Phelps-Roper TED Talk: https://www.ted.com/talks/megan_phelps_roper_i_grew_up_in_the_westboro_baptist_church_here_s_why_i_left?language=en  The Witch Trials of JK Rowling: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-witch-trials-of-j-k-rowling/id1671691064  Crime Analyst: https://www.crime-analyst.com/   Real Crime Profile: https://www.realcrimeprofile.com/   Law & Crime Networks coverage of Kowalski v Johns Hopkins All Childrens:    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZTZxCMy8Oc   To support the show, subscribe on Apple Podcasts or go to Patreon.com/NobodyShouldBelieveMe where you can listen to exclusive bonus content and access all episodes early and ad-free, including weekly recaps of the Kowalski trial.   Follow host Andrea Dunlop on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop  Buy Andrea’s books here.  For more information and resources on Munchausen by Proxy, please visit MunchausenSupport.com  Note: This episode contains sensitive content related to child abuse. Listener discretion is advised.  Download the APSAC's practice guidelines here.  ***  Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

As the Kowalski v Johns Hopkins All Childrens trial barrels forward, new information comes to light each day about what really happened to Maya Kowalski during her time in the hospital. In part 2 of The Believers, Andrea digs into the testimony from the doctors at the center of the case and finds medical professionals at odds. Did Maya really have CRPS or was something else going on? With trial watchers choosing sides and digging in: what does the evidence actually tell us?  Andrea also talks more about her conversation with Laura Richards and her co-host Jim Clemente, following up on some of the leads they presented.  NOTE: It came up in court on 11/1 in the rebuttal that Dr. Chopra did NOT attend Harvard Medical School, but rather an institution in India affiliated with HMS. He also clarified that he is a clinical assistant professor at Brown rather than a full professor.  *** Read about Dr. Chopra’s beliefs about medical child abuse here: https://painri.com/epidemic-child-abuse-doctors-harming-children/  Crime Analyst: https://www.crime-analyst.com/   Real Crime Profile: https://www.realcrimeprofile.com/   Law & Crime Networks coverage of Kowalski v Johns Hopkins All Childrens:    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZTZxCMy8Oc   To support the show, subscribe on Apple Podcasts or go to Patreon.com/NobodyShouldBelieveMe where you can listen to exclusive bonus content and access all episodes early and ad-free, including weekly recaps of the Kowalski trial.   Follow host Andrea Dunlop on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop  Buy Andrea’s books here.  For more information and resources on Munchausen by Proxy, please visit MunchausenSupport.com  Download the APSAC's practice guidelines here.  ***  Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! Note: This episode contains sensitive content related to child abuse. Listener discretion is advised.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

With a verdict in the case days away, host Andrea Dunlop unpacks some of what’s happened so far in the Kowalski v Johns Hopkins All Childrens trial with lawyer and trial consultant Jonathan Leach. They analyze the dueling opening statements, consider what each side is likely to look for in jurors, and which of the charges—if any—might be most viable.   Andrea shares insights on the lawyers after watching their interactions in court. She also weighs in on the extensive medical testimony so far, including a major revelation about the origins of Maya's controversial CRPS diagnosis. We also share a chilling account of Maya’s ketamine coma that was shared in court via missives written by Beata herself.   As both sides begin their closing arguments Andrea weighs the merits of what each side has told the jury and considers what the ramifications of the imminent verdict might be.  *** To support the show, subscribe on Apple Podcasts or go to Patreon.com/NobodyShouldBelieveMe where you can listen to exclusive bonus content and access all episodes early and ad-free, including weekly recaps of the Kowalski trial.   Follow host Andrea Dunlop on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop  Buy Andrea’s books here.  For more information and resources on Munchausen by Proxy, please visit MunchausenSupport.com  Download the APSAC's practice guidelines here.  ***  Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Andrea and special guest Bex (aka our Florida pediatrcian friend) process the shocking verdict in the Maya Kowalski trial. After 9 weeks of testimony, the jury awarded the Kowalski family nearly $300 million in damages from Johns Hopkins All Children's Hospital. Bex shares her perspective as a pediatrician on how this verdict will impact the medical community and reporting of suspected child abuse cases. They discuss the implications for social workers and hospital staff who stood up and testified, and grapple with how the jury seemed to side with the emotional storytelling despite medical evidence. Andrea and Bex reflect on what this means for the U.S. justice system, mandatory reporting laws, and the public's willingness to accept that medical child abuse exists.  *** Follow host Andrea Dunlop on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop Buy Andrea’s books here. For more information and resources on Munchausen by Proxy, please visit MunchausenSupport.com Note: This episode contains sensitive content related to child abuse. Listener discretion is advised. Download the APSAC's practice guidelines here. *** Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Andrea checks in with lawyer and trial consultant Jonathan Leach hours after the Kowalski verdict comes down. They talk about the judge’s decision to disallow testimony from the defense on medical child abuse, what happened with this jury, and the chances for a possible appeal for JHAC.   With the medical community reeling from this news, Jonathan and Andrea unpack the dire consequences of the verdict and wonder — what now?   *** Follow host Andrea Dunlop on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop  Buy Andrea’s books here.  For more information and resources on Munchausen by Proxy, please visit MunchausenSupport.com  Note: This episode contains sensitive content related to child abuse. Listener discretion is advised.  Download the APSAC's practice guidelines here.  ***  Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

As we continue to process the far-reaching implications of the shocking verdict in the Kowalski case, we take a closer look at Maya Kowalski’s testimony and what we know about her. She’s emerged as a divisive figure in the case: alternately being cast as a brave heroine or as a manipulator. But given the evidence of her possible abuse and the questionable motives of the adults surrounding her, the truth is far more nuanced.    We bring in survivor Jordyn Hope and child and adolescent psychiatrist Dr. Mary Sanders to help unpack the impact of trauma on memory and the aftereffects of medical child abuse. As Maya continues to be thrust into the spotlight for a role she didn’t choose, we grapple with the outcome of what it could all mean for her.  ***  Munchausen Support accepts donations and volunteers at www.munhausensupport.com   If you have a story about medical child abuse that you are ready to share you can tag @andreadunlop, email hello@nobodyshouldbelieveme.com or leave us a voicemail at (484) 768-0266  Follow host Andrea Dunlop on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop  Buy Andrea’s books here.  Note: This episode contains sensitive content related to child abuse. Listener discretion is advised.  Download the APSAC's practice guidelines here.  ***  Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

With the jury's stunning $242 million verdict in favor of the Kowalski family, host Andrea Dunlop looks at why this case has struck such a nerve on both sides of the political spectrum. She examines why some mothers accused of medical child abuse are viewed as monsters and others as martyrs.   Andrea looks at the charges against social worker Cathy Bedy the woman who became the face of the child welfare bureaucracy during the Maya Kowalski case and examines her testimony.   We also seek out answers about the troubled state of child welfare in America by talking to Dr. Jessica Pryce, author of the forthcoming book Broken: Transforming Child Protective Services—Notes of a Former Caseworker.  Dr. Pryce shares heart-wrenching stories of mothers whose lives have been turned upside down by investigations and sets out a compelling and urgent case for an overhaul of CPS. With her inside view of the system, she also gives insight on how doctors and other mandated reporters can do the best for the families they want to help even within the current, deeply flawed system.   This episode grapples with the complexity around reporting child abuse suspicions and the potentially chilling ripple effects of the explosive verdict in Kowalski v Johns Hopkins All Childrens. It examines the lack of support for struggling parents in America, while leaving the listener with urgent questions about justice and equity.  *** Pre-order Dr. Jessica Pryce’s book here:  https://www.amazon.com/Broken-Transforming-Protective-Services_Notes-Caseworker/dp/0063036193  Learn more about Dr. Pryce’s work on her website: https://jessicaprycephd.com/   Munchausen Support accepts donations and volunteers at www.munchausensupport.com    If you have a story about medical child abuse that you are ready to share you can tag @andreadunlop, email hello@nobodyshouldbelieveme.com or leave us a voicemail at (484) 768-0266  Follow host Andrea Dunlop on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop  Buy Andrea’s books here.  *** Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! Note: This episode contains sensitive content related to child abuse. Listener discretion is advised.  Download the APSAC's practice guidelines here.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

We'll be back next week with five new episodes to close out Season Three! In the meantime, we're sharing a fascinating conversation between Andrea and podcaster and author Jo Piazza on her show Under the Influence, which is all about women and the internet. They discuss how MBP manifests on social media and what to look out for.   Follow Under the Influencer wherever you listen to podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/munchausen-by-proxy-on-the-socials/id1544171101?i=1000629012835  Pre-order Jo Piazza's new novel Sicilian Inheritance here: https://www.amazon.com/Sicilian-Inheritance-Novel-Jo-Piazza/dp/0593474163 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Just when we thought the endless saga of Kowalski v Johns Hopkins All Childrens was over...it turns out it might only be beginning.  In this episode, lead attorney for the Johns Hopkins All Childrens defense team, Ethen Shapiro, offers an insider's perspective on what happened in during the trial and what’s happened in the wake of it.  Tina and Andrea discuss newly introduced evidence including Beata's requests to increase medications despite risks, Dr. Kirkpatrick's questionable diagnostic process, and communications illuminating Beata's substantial role in daughter Maya's care.   Shapiro unpacks how harmful the verdict is for healthcare providers now unsure about reporting potential abuse and explains why the media coverage of this case and others like it is asymmetrical warfare.   We discuss the motion for a new trial based on juror misconduct, what happens next, and what it all means.  *** Read Beata's emails and view Ethen Shapiro's slide deck laying out the case: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1FpSFjvX_8WB5cgPCI0E_cpXj1jaeVcC4?usp=sharing Watch Ethen Shapiro's closing arguments on Law & Crime's YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3HBYKAN3BxM  Munchausen Support accepts donations and volunteers at www.munchausensupport.com   If you have a story about medical child abuse that you are ready to share you can tag @andreadunlop, email hello@nobodyshouldbelieveme.com or leave us a voicemail at (484) 768-0266  *** Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! *** Follow host Andrea Dunlop on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop  Buy Andrea’s books here.  Download the APSAC's practice guidelines here.  Note: This episode contains sensitive content related to child abuse. Listener discretion is advised.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This week Andrea examines how the harrowing and complex story of the Maya Kowalski case turned into a pop culture moment, and spread dangerous misinformation in the process.   We continue our conversation with Ethen Shapiro, lead attorney for Johns Hopkins All Childrens, about how the media coverage of this case got so out of hand and the risks it poses to doctors and children going forward.    We take a deeper look at how entertainment reporter Caitlin Keating stumbled onto the story at her job at People Magazine, and despite her questionable grasp of medical child abuse issues, made a movie about a complicated case that was subsequently viewed by millions of people.   Andrea shares revelations from Beata Kowalski's blog, written disturbingly in her young daughter Maya's voice, and wonders how anyone can ignore its terrifying contents.   Stay tuned for a sneak peek of our exclusive interview featured in our season finale.  *** Read Beata’s blog: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1FpSFjvX_8WB5cgPCI0E_cpXj1jaeVcC4?usp=drive_link   Megan Fox YouTube interview with Gregory Anderson: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22eytc7v8oc&t=9693s   Kat and Nat Unfiltered: https://catandnat.ca/new-blog/hhttps/openspotifycom/take-care-of-maya-with-caitlin-keating   Guys We Fucked podcast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlbosK25e7U   Munchausen Support accepts donations and volunteers at www.munchausensupport.com   *** Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! If you have a story about medical child abuse that you are ready to share you can tag @andreadunlop, email hello@nobodyshouldbelieveme.com or leave us a voicemail at (484) 768-0266  Follow host Andrea Dunlop on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop  Buy Andrea’s books here.  Download the APSAC's practice guidelines here.  Note: This episode contains sensitive content related to child abuse. Listener discretion is advised.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this bonus episode, host Andrea interviews regular guest and friend of the show Jordyn Hope, a survivor of Munchausen by proxy abuse. Jo shares their personal story of revelations of abuse and recounts the emotional toll of constantly having to prove their own sickness.  Andrea and Jo discuss the Maya Kowalski case and Jo provides insight into the parent-child dynamics, including the enmeshment, lack of boundaries, and parentification often seen in abusive situations. Andrea and Jo grapple with the complicated feelings around Maya's continued defense of her mother.   Jo also opens up about how painful it is for survivors to hear their abuse erased and denied. They offer a message of validation and fight to other survivors struggling with self-doubt in the wake of this high-profile case. This is a thoughtful, nuanced discussion around the themes of voice, compassion, and the ripple effects of denying abuse.  *** Munchausen Support accepts donations and volunteers at www.munchausensupport.com   Click here to view our sponsors. Remember that using our codes helps advertisers know you’re listening and helps us keep making the show! If you have a story about medical child abuse that you are ready to share you can tag @andreadunlop, email hello@nobodyshouldbelieveme.com or leave us a voicemail at (484) 768-0266   Follow host Andrea Dunlop on Instagram for behind-the-scenes photos: @andreadunlop  Buy Andrea’s books here.  Download the APSAC's practice guidelines here.  ***  Note: This episode contains sensitive content related to child abuse. Listener discretion is advised.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices